1/13
I noticed something in my time line that actually made me angry and had to respond. Somebody straight off said they were proud of their Green Party vote in 2016. That didn't garner the response they hoped they'd get. Let me explain to you WHY third party/protest voting isn't beneficial.
10:09 PM - Jun 05, 2023
2/13
First, America was never set up to have a multi-party system like Canada, the UK, France, and other parliamentary countries. Even the UK has a major, sustainable third party, the Liberal Democrats. The USA started with the Federalists, and the Democratic-Republican Party.
10:10 PM - Jun 05, 2023
3/13
Also it's very rare for a third party to win a seat in congress, or in the state/local races. Indies would have a better shot, since by nature most educated/logical ones (like Angus King) would form a coalition with the Democrats (and vice versa with Evan McMullan of Utah).
10:12 PM - Jun 05, 2023
4/13
Third, Third parties have NEVER made headway into a presidential election. Even Teddy Roosevelt whom was a Republican was rebuffed when he tried to run as a Bull Moose party after his term.
10:13 PM - Jun 05, 2023
5/13
George Wallace (who was a Dixiecrat) tried to run with the American Independence Party which used busing, and desegregation as the dog whistles of "woke" and CRT is used by the GOP today. However, the AIP siphoned votes away from the Democrats and give Nixon the bare win in 1968.
10:14 PM - Jun 05, 2023
6/13
Another third party challenger was H. Ross Perot (whom could have ran as a Republican) in 1992. However While Perot did get 19% of the total votes then...he still lost. Unlike other third partiers, he actually attempted to discuss policy...however the VP Debates sunk him.
10:16 PM - Jun 05, 2023
7/13
Now we're getting into Ralph Nader (whom as an investigative journalist and consumer advocate was tops). He has run...he was the one who siphoned votes way from Gore (and helped Bush win with an Assist from the SCOTUS with Brett Kavanaugh, Amy Barret, and John Roberts) with team Bush.
10:17 PM - Jun 05, 2023
8/13
That 2000 election was decided by less than 600 votes. When the SCOTUS ruled that the counts had to end. Think about it...if Nader didn't run, or if people didn't withhold their votes, Gore would have been president with Joe Liberman as his VP.
10:18 PM - Jun 05, 2023
9/13
Now...we're getting into 2016...the perfect storm of fuckery. First we had the known Russian interference with the elections, with an assist by Steve Bannon with Cambridge Analyitca (which has caused Meta to settle a class action against them).
10:19 PM - Jun 05, 2023
10/13
The second part of the perfect storm is partially Hillary's fault as she made the fatal error to assume she was going to win. In politics never assume you're going to win, you have to go fight for all the votes.
10:20 PM - Jun 05, 2023
11/13
The biggest thing that helped Trump win ultimately were Jill Stein and Gary Johnson. Remember when I said the AIP in 1968 siphoned votes...and in 2000 when Nader siphoned votes...this happened again in 3 States, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin where Trump barely won.
10:21 PM - Jun 05, 2023
12/13
That was just enough people to vote for Stein or Johnson that cost Hillary the race (I didn't touch also on James Comey torpedoing her with an "investigation" into those e-mails).
10:22 PM - Jun 05, 2023
13/13
In total...in America voting for a third party is a fatal mistake since our system isn't designed for it. It also is a fatal mistake to do a protest vote against a candidate with a better record and better morals for a guy like Trump who had a set-up persona, or for DeSantis who's just an ass.
10:24 PM - Jun 05, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
If people genuinely want a third party, they need to build it from the local elections up. They can't just appear every four years. They're not serious people, they just want attention
06:11 PM - Nov 09, 2023
In response to Cynthia.
Exactly. The US was not built as a parliamentary system (Like the UK where the Liberal Democrats (Lib Dems) are a major third party to the Labour and Tories). Also under our system a party has to die for a new one to take place.
06:17 PM - Nov 09, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
Especially when that “third party” is a stalking horse set up by Republican big money interests for the express purpose of siphoning votes away from Democrats. Looking at you, No Labels.
09:07 PM - Sep 24, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
The Green Party has become Putin’s tool.
12:28 PM - Sep 24, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
Excellent thread. Absolutely spot on.
I've tried explaining Duverger's Law to no avail to the third party types but whatever. https://en.wikipedia.org/w...
I've tried explaining Duverger's Law to no avail to the third party types but whatever. https://en.wikipedia.org/w...
09:24 AM - Sep 07, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
I have heard a disturbing number of Democrats (i.e. Bernie bros) express support for both Kennedy (ugh) and Williamson (cuckoo) because "Joe's too old" 🙄, and I wonder how many votes they may siphon off. I just wish Dems were better on messaging...[sigh]
12:55 AM - Jun 16, 2023
In response to Penny.
That's up to us. Because that all costs money. Plus let's face it, we have to do the heavy lifting ourselves and not assume somebody else will do it. That's why a lot of folks do education through canvass, post cards, and phone/text banking, plus donations when they can.
01:16 AM - Jun 16, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
I never realized how fucked we were until Labor Day 2016. I was at the Labor Fest in the beer tent and a Union guy said “I’m voting for Jill Stein. Hillary sold our uranium to the Russians”.
05:26 PM - Jun 06, 2023
In response to dmark.
I remember that trope. She wasn't involved in that, but that was CIFUS that approved the sale from a Canadian based company. Also I find it tragic that Trump was working for the same Russians.
05:28 PM - Jun 06, 2023
In response to dmark.
I knew she would lose Ohio when I was at an NBA game, a HRC commercial came on, & there was a LOT of booing. After LeBron had endorsed her.
05:32 PM - Jun 06, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
Cornel will get some liberal academic and ADOS/FBA votes. Grift the campaign funds, write a book, go back to the Ivy League, get a divorce and a new younger wife.
08:36 AM - Jun 06, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
Even in the UK FPTP means that our small parties get very little.
Greens get 10% of the vote and 1MP (out of over 600).
The value of a 3rd party/protest vote is to apply pressure on the main party by withholding support unless they earn it. That's how Republicans and Tories have been driven right.
Greens get 10% of the vote and 1MP (out of over 600).
The value of a 3rd party/protest vote is to apply pressure on the main party by withholding support unless they earn it. That's how Republicans and Tories have been driven right.
04:14 AM - Jun 06, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
And now we have this! Cornel West is a brilliant man, what the heck does he think he is accomplishing with this?
https://www.theguardian.co...
https://www.theguardian.co...
11:06 PM - Jun 05, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
Lyndon LaRouche was always there to pull some votes, too.
Had a business acquaintance that was proud of his LaRouche ‘protest’ vote every four years.
Had a business acquaintance that was proud of his LaRouche ‘protest’ vote every four years.
11:03 PM - Jun 05, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
Thank you so much for the thoroughness of this thread. It includes every explanation of why voting for a third party candidate will not protect our democracy in 2024.
10:59 PM - Jun 05, 2023
In response to RobPalmerIRL (he/him/his).
But doesn't this create a situation where the democratic party is made immune to criticism by their base due to a very rational fear of Republicans? And wouldn't this immunity lead to complacency and corruption?
10:42 PM - Jun 05, 2023
In response to Aamir Hussain.
Far from it. They're not immune from criticism. If anything people look at the some total of policy, records, and character.
10:44 PM - Jun 05, 2023
