first you punch down on Native Americans/Indigenous people, and now this?
what is going on with "allies?"
what is going on with "allies?"
Jim Plunkett @JimP32This is a bit simplistic, but basically correct
Trans M->F athletes should qualify/DSQ as if they were taking M hormones as PEDs for the time & doses they were circulating in their blood pre-transition
If a sport allows F-athletes to take testosterone++ from age 12-18?, then compete, else DSQd06:17 PM - Mar 18, 2024
07:18 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to Lynn Massie 💙.
What is it that you think is unfair abt measuring hormone levels? Someone who transitioned early (or blocked puberty then took normal levels of hormone) would pass easily
I said Jenner's approach was oversimplisitc, but ignoring that some can get hormones that others don't is unfair.
I said Jenner's approach was oversimplisitc, but ignoring that some can get hormones that others don't is unfair.
08:09 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
I think you need to do considerably more reading about hormone levels in both cis and trans folx, before you make uninformed comments like this.
And as a former elite female athlete, I can say without question that we don't need you to "protect" our sports from trans women.
And as a former elite female athlete, I can say without question that we don't need you to "protect" our sports from trans women.
08:18 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to RA.
Hey! good to meet another fmr world-level competitor here!
It's not the current hormone levels I'm referring to, it's the M levels of androgens through the growth years, when the serious muscle base & bone struct is built
I'll take your nudge and read more too; any pointers welcome
It's not the current hormone levels I'm referring to, it's the M levels of androgens through the growth years, when the serious muscle base & bone struct is built
I'll take your nudge and read more too; any pointers welcome
09:34 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
My suggestion would be to widen your concept of what a woman can be as you learn more. Hormones are not cut and dry, and neither is gender. For example, setting aside trans folx for a minute, there is natural occurring overlap in testosterone levels of women with PCOS and men with low testosterone.
09:42 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to RA.
Yes, def a wide range, and indeed overlap, on basically every parameter & combination. Overlaps edge-cases are *very* hard
Elite sport is different; the *only* area I have any trans issue
So far, literally the 1st study I found in today's search quite confirmed my prev knowledge
I'll keep looking
Elite sport is different; the *only* area I have any trans issue
So far, literally the 1st study I found in today's search quite confirmed my prev knowledge
I'll keep looking
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Transwoman Elite Athletes: Their Extra Percentage Relative to Female Physiology - PMC
There is increasing debate as to whether transwoman athletes should be included in the elite female competition. Most elite sports are divided into male and female divisions because of the greater athletic performance displayed by males. Without the sex ...
10:10 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
This chipping away at trans rights is the same game conservative Christians have been playing with abortion rights. It's not about the hormones. It never was. It is a red herring argument.
10:15 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to RA.
I get that this is a slippery slope argument (I've got both a neighbor's kid and a very good friend who are trans; I'm not trying to chip away at anything)
At the same time, I get that it also has real physical potential to trash Title IX
And physics is physics; hormone therapy only goes so far
At the same time, I get that it also has real physical potential to trash Title IX
And physics is physics; hormone therapy only goes so far
10:21 PM - Mar 18, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
If you want to do something that will actually protect female athletes, focus on getting rid of all the coaches who groom and rape them. That's the real issue in women's sports. That's what is really effecting performance. Not making space for the 2% of trans athletes.
10:28 PM - Mar 18, 2024
(Edited)
In response to RA.
OK: 2% of trans athletes
Yet we both know elite sports are won/lost by fractions of a percent
With a small% advantage, those 2% of trans will dominate podiums, shutting out the 98% of women
The BJSM study showed an AVERAGE ~5.5% and up to 16%+ T vs F advantage in 1.5mi run, AFTER...
Yet we both know elite sports are won/lost by fractions of a percent
With a small% advantage, those 2% of trans will dominate podiums, shutting out the 98% of women
The BJSM study showed an AVERAGE ~5.5% and up to 16%+ T vs F advantage in 1.5mi run, AFTER...
11:25 AM - Mar 19, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
...AFTER 2.5 years of T hormone therapy
In the NCAA 1500m final, the difference between 5th and 1st place was 0.6%
A 5-16%+ advantage hands the win — and the scholarships & opportunities that go with it — to a competitor who wouldn't even qualify for the finals on a fair field. ...
In the NCAA 1500m final, the difference between 5th and 1st place was 0.6%
A 5-16%+ advantage hands the win — and the scholarships & opportunities that go with it — to a competitor who wouldn't even qualify for the finals on a fair field. ...
11:26 AM - Mar 19, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
The Title IX solution was NOT to say [all women can compete on any man's team] but that [women's sports programs shall be separate and equal]. When the data are so clear about the inevitable results, waiting until an entire generation of womens sports is trashed to do something about it...
11:26 AM - Mar 19, 2024
... is deeply unfair. They should actually just have their own category, as do the various levels of paralympic competitors for varying levels of disability.
Obviously, there are some sports where there is no material advantage, and they SHOULD be able to compete...
Obviously, there are some sports where there is no material advantage, and they SHOULD be able to compete...
In response to Jim Plunkett.
11:26 AM - Mar 19, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
... in those arenas. Similarly, (contrary to Jenner) competitors who medically transitioned pre-puberty so did not get the androgenic advantage, SHOULD BE ALLOWED to compete as W (unless evidence arises of significant advantage).
You say "only 2%" is basically immaterial, despite...
You say "only 2%" is basically immaterial, despite...
11:27 AM - Mar 19, 2024
In response to Jim Plunkett.
... repeatable data showing materially disadvantaging all women athletes. Maybe consider that the new record of 520k NCAA student-athletes is only 2.8% of the 18.1 million students, and this would proscribe participation in only 2.8% of the activities.
11:27 AM - Mar 19, 2024